now before we get to posting here i would just like to say that i am in no way trying to force my beliefs onto any of you nor do i wish for anyone to try to force any onto me or anyone else. i'm just curios to know what everyone else out there believes. personally im agnostic leaning more towards athiest.
I walk between the candle and the dark. That is, to say, I believe in an afterlife and in the good feelings that faith and God can bring, but I would be at a loss to proof my own personal viewpoint to others, nor do I think I should try to convert others.
Generally speaking, I'm agnostic, but with a personal bias more toward *some* sort of God, though not necessarily any God extolled by popular faith and religion.
I am apathetic when it comes to religion. If there is an afterlife, I'll find out when I'm dead, but I'm not dead, so there's no point in wasting my life worrying about what happens to me after death.
As of late, I'm agnostic, I used to believe, but I'm having a rather hard time doing so now. It gets sorta hard when the world around you just seems so violent and ugly.
Er, I feel that many would consider my opinion on this kind of dismal.
Growing up I was pretty much raised catholic, but my parents were never forceful of religious opinions. Going to church was just something that they thought me and my brother could learn from. I think it wasn't long after high school that I would start applying the label of atheist to myself. I would love to believe in an after life, but really after death I don't think there really is anything. You simply do not exist anymore. I don't think this as too depressing though, but more encouraging of life and to make the most of it while you're able to.
Regardless I think people should focus themselves on what it means to be alive, and how they can make the most of things.
I suppose I should put in my 2 cents.
I'm not really sure what I am. I kinda agree with Star on the whole "I believe but don't think I should force others too" thing, and I believe that God raised Jesus from the dead and all, but I just have trouble with how people present Him. We constantly say that he is a loving and just God, but we always use examples where He seems to be more of a tyrannical dictator when we try to get our point across. (I say "we" under the assumption that I am indeed Christian, not a Dieist like my roommate says I am.) On top of it all, we tend to all have this dream-like persona and have a bad habit of going around telling people that they're wrong for being who they are.
If that's not enough, some even use the loving side of Christianity as a means to ridicule and belittle others simply because they live differently from use. My best example of this would be my Grandma using manners and God as to reasons why everything I'm into---videogames, anime, cartoons, staying indoors---is evil when in reality she' just bitter and taking here anger about my blood Grandmother being who she is. (Grandma is my Grandpa's wife, but not the mother of his child.) And having been through at least three denominations (Baptist, Methodist, Cathlolic) I can say for certain that these are common faults that none of us seem to really notice in ourselves, or don't care to admit to.
The worst part is that we all go around actng as though we know exactly what God wants. How can we know? If He is indeed "incomprehensible" to humans, then how can any of us say that we know what He wants? We can't comprehend Him, let alone what He wants!
I get the feeing that I am exaggerating some of this, but this is how I feel.
I have to say, packrat, I agree with some of the things you say. A lot of people use God as an excuse to hate something else, which isn't the point of God.
I was raised a Congregationalist Christian, and I still hold true to it. I believe in God, I believe in the afterlife, and I believe that Jesus was the messiah. However, I don't believe that God necessarily created the earth in intelligent design, or that he's influenced the world as much as the Bible says he has.
Also, going back to people using God as an excuse to hate people; they're really missing the point of God. God is supposed to be ever loving, ever forgiving, and ever merciful without bias. (Well, that's my opinion) God is not some sort of tyrannical dictator or distant master who spins strange fates for people, he's an ever present deity that invokes hope, faith, and goodness.
People lacking a faith in God may respond to this by saying "There's so much suffering and strife in the world! If this God is so powerful and kind, why would he allow such things to happen?" Well, just like how nothing good can last forever, there can be no good without evil. Because good and evil are ideas, without its opposite, the other cannot exist. To quote my pastor, "In the large tapestry of life, it is impossible to see what is coming. Only God can see the top, to weave the threads together. You are on the bottom, and can only see one thread at a time. Many would expect God to weave a tapestry of Gold and Silver. However, he knows that along with the light colors, dark colors are also needed. The light colors of the tapestry of life shine even brighter in contrast to the dark ones, and without each other, the true beauty of the masterpiece cannot be achieved. So do not despair when the darker weaves may present themselves, for it will not be long when you join God on the other side of the tapestry and see the wondrous things he has woven for you." (This may have been paraphrased...a lot..but the message is the same.)
So I suppose I see God more as an influential spectator than a dictatorial puppet-master.
I worship every conceivable god. Not separately, but all as part of a singular entity. It's worked out well.
Quote from: TaintedLove on September 15, 2009, 08:46:53 AM
I worship every conceivable god. Not separately, but all as part of a singular entity. It's worked out well.
So, it's like a mass collective, like the Borgs from star trek? They're all individual, but they're essential beings are interconnected with one another?
Similar but different. Like, less separate, but no less individual. Like, inherently the same being, manifesting in all different fashions possible simultaneously at all times. Subjective, as well. In this fashion, all sentient beings will perceive * differently.
Quote from: TaintedLove on September 15, 2009, 02:16:42 PM
Similar but different. Like, less separate, but no less individual. Like, inherently the same being, manifesting in all different fashions possible simultaneously at all times. Subjective, as well. In this fashion, all sentient beings will perceive * differently.
well i have to say that is certainly a unique outlook. i didn't know it was possible to worship everything.
I was raised Catholic. But I have to admit that I never go to the church.
I believe in a loving God. One that always forgive, just and merciful. I believe in the eternal life. And I also believe that, when we die, God will take us to the paradise, a place of real happiness. (I like to think that the paradise is like an anime, but nobody really knows how is it).
I used to pray every night, asking God for protection for me and for all my family, and also saying Him that I'm grateful because He gave me the life. Now I don't pray every night, but sometimes I tell God: "Thank you for my life". Is the less I can do.
Quote from: TaintedLove on September 15, 2009, 02:16:42 PM
Similar but different. Like, less separate, but no less individual. Like, inherently the same being, manifesting in all different fashions possible simultaneously at all times. Subjective, as well. In this fashion, all sentient beings will perceive * differently.
So it's like the omnipresence idea. You don't believe in a singular god, but that everything that is makes up to be the divine presence? I like your idea, it's very...open. I can see how that would have a lot of positives to it.
However, what is the general attitude of your multi-god? Is it loving and merciful, random and carefree, harsh and natural, or just everything all at once again?
Amusing this topic popped up. I've just been reading parts of The Brick Testament (http://www.thebricktestament.com). By far my favourite way to read the Bible :) Merely while reading the first part of the Genesis couldn't help but go "Well, this makes no sense...". The various laws are quite amusing, though.
Quote from: TaintedLove on September 15, 2009, 02:16:42 PM
Similar but different. Like, less separate, but no less individual. Like, inherently the same being, manifesting in all different fashions possible simultaneously at all times. Subjective, as well. In this fashion, all sentient beings will perceive * differently.
Is that like Kosh from Babylon 5? I remember a crowd of people all looked at him at the same time and each person saw something different.
I can see both good and bad things coming with this. On the good side it would allow everyone to have the god that suits him or her best, and nobody would have to be wrong even if the views contradict each other. The bad thing... is that most people aren't capable of this kind of reasoning, and some would even fight to the death over who has the better god.
Quote from: Serika on September 23, 2009, 03:52:12 PM
The bad thing... is that most people aren't capable of this kind of reasoning, and some would even fight to the death over who has the better god.
Don't people already do that? I mean with the Islamic extremists claiming that Allah is better than Jesus or Jehovah and whatnot? >.>
Quote from: The_Enigma on September 18, 2009, 01:39:25 PM
Quote from: TaintedLove on September 15, 2009, 02:16:42 PM
Similar but different. Like, less separate, but no less individual. Like, inherently the same being, manifesting in all different fashions possible simultaneously at all times. Subjective, as well. In this fashion, all sentient beings will perceive * differently.
So it's like the omnipresence idea. You don't believe in a singular god, but that everything that is makes up to be the divine presence? I like your idea, it's very...open. I can see how that would have a lot of positives to it.
However, what is the general attitude of your multi-god? Is it loving and merciful, random and carefree, harsh and natural, or just everything all at once again?
To give everyone a general idea of what TL is talking about, I provide a visual representation below.
I don't know if there is a god, but if there is one who really created us and is controlling us like religion says then he's a sadist.
I don't even wanna say anything about me and religion coz that'd make it personal, but at the end of the day it's all about faith IMO. You can go as far as "facts" and historical "proof" to an extent, but theres so much slander and lies from people who don't have all the facts but have a bigger mouth, compared to people who took time to figure out asd much as they can before forming an opinion. IMO its not even worth discussing because in my experience of ~18 years, for the most part people will simply not listen to something they don't want to hear. When most people think they have an upper hand or some "reasonable" grounding, they won't listen to logic OR reason. Humans are lazy by nature.
The wind blows, but you can't proove it exists. You cant see, feel, hear, or smell it. You can only see the effects it has on everything else.
I am christian
Hey, animepee... Love your new avatar. :clap:
Really now. I hate it because it's huge, obnoxious and from a horrible ass anime. And the sig is even worse, since it's borderline spam.
Summary of Inuyasha:
"INUYASHA!"
"KAGOME!"
"INUYASHA!"
"KAGOME!"
"INUYASHA!"
"KAGOME!"
"INUYASHA!"
"KAGOME!"
"INUYASHA!"
"KAGOME!"
Repeat for 167 episodes and 4 movies.
Horrible ass anime? See, coming from a self-styled anime hater such as yourself, that almost makes it a compliment, :lol:
I do agree it's a bit annoying on the name calling part, but there are some episodes that do, really, touch my soul, so I can't hate it 100%.
Actually, that's true. There were a few moments. And Miroku's a fun guy. Maybe if they made Inuyasha Kai, it would be a good show. After all, it turned DBZ from "Okay show" to "Good show".
Hijacked thread much?
Hashish for advanced member.
me?
im hardcore athiest,
im into technology and science and this is my theory, bare with me and this is not intended to be offencive(bud if your a super religious type i would turn away)
anyways, my theory is that the world is amazing, the universe is emence, way to emence to even begin to comprehend, i mean it wasnt that long ago that we thought the world was flat, so my theory is that, us humans as it is our nature, always want the easy way out, there is no way for us to even begin to understand how we came to be, so therefore we substitute it with an easy way out, god, its simple, we dont understand it so we make up an answer,
Quote from: hashish on October 04, 2009, 01:20:47 PM
The wind blows, but you can't proove it exists.
What.
Quote from: mdunham1440 on October 06, 2009, 09:16:38 PM
me?
im hardcore athiest,
im into technology and science and this is my theory, bare with me and this is not intended to be offencive(bud if your a super religious type i would turn away)
anyways, my theory is that the world is amazing, the universe is emence, way to emence to even begin to comprehend, i mean it wasnt that long ago that we thought the world was flat, so my theory is that, us humans as it is our nature, always want the easy way out, there is no way for us to even begin to understand how we came to be, so therefore we substitute it with an easy way out, god, its simple, we dont understand it so we make up an answer,
I believe you meant "immense," sir. And I can see where you come from; logic beats faith. Answers beat myth. Absolute proof beats an air of mystery. However, whether God is real or not, religion in itself bears many prosperous fruits for the betterment of humanity. Sure, you might say that wars are fought in the name of religion, but I must say that the good that religion brings far outweighs the terribleness of the wars fought over it. And that's not even to mention that no religion even promotes war...the wars are fought by the people, not by the religion.
Quote from: FallenStar on October 05, 2009, 07:24:46 PM
Hey, animepee... Love your new avatar. :clap:
Thanks star ^^
and i have had this signature for a
long time, if star or a mod ever wants me to remove it i will :/
and sorry about that, so yeah im a christian, ive been one since i was like, 12 or 13 i believe
Quote from: The_Enigma on October 07, 2009, 11:48:13 AM
Quote from: mdunham1440 on October 06, 2009, 09:16:38 PM
me?
im hardcore athiest,
im into technology and science and this is my theory, bare with me and this is not intended to be offencive(bud if your a super religious type i would turn away)
anyways, my theory is that the world is amazing, the universe is emence, way to emence to even begin to comprehend, i mean it wasnt that long ago that we thought the world was flat, so my theory is that, us humans as it is our nature, always want the easy way out, there is no way for us to even begin to understand how we came to be, so therefore we substitute it with an easy way out, god, its simple, we dont understand it so we make up an answer,
I believe you meant "immense," sir. And I can see where you come from; logic beats faith. Answers beat myth. Absolute proof beats an air of mystery. However, whether God is real or not, religion in itself bears many prosperous fruits for the betterment of humanity. Sure, you might say that wars are fought in the name of religion, but I must say that the good that religion brings far outweighs the terribleness of the wars fought over it. And that's not even to mention that no religion even promotes war...the wars are fought by the people, not by the religion.
I like that what you guys are touching on there, and I kinda think the same way. I believe in intelligent design for sure, to me it just makes pure logical sense as much as I can make of it, but at the same time as I see how logic beats faith, I overrule it with the fact that people make their own truth. If an uneducated child bought up in the deepest jungle was told the sky was blue because it was painted, how could he ever know different. We make human truths and logic within our parameters, but theres stuff out there we don't know and can't explain, supernatural stuff. Stuff so complex im sure it cannot be random.
Quote from: hashish on October 09, 2009, 06:55:13 PM
Quote from: The_Enigma on October 07, 2009, 11:48:13 AM
Quote from: mdunham1440 on October 06, 2009, 09:16:38 PM
me?
im hardcore athiest,
im into technology and science and this is my theory, bare with me and this is not intended to be offencive(bud if your a super religious type i would turn away)
anyways, my theory is that the world is amazing, the universe is emence, way to emence to even begin to comprehend, i mean it wasnt that long ago that we thought the world was flat, so my theory is that, us humans as it is our nature, always want the easy way out, there is no way for us to even begin to understand how we came to be, so therefore we substitute it with an easy way out, god, its simple, we dont understand it so we make up an answer,
I believe you meant "immense," sir. And I can see where you come from; logic beats faith. Answers beat myth. Absolute proof beats an air of mystery. However, whether God is real or not, religion in itself bears many prosperous fruits for the betterment of humanity. Sure, you might say that wars are fought in the name of religion, but I must say that the good that religion brings far outweighs the terribleness of the wars fought over it. And that's not even to mention that no religion even promotes war...the wars are fought by the people, not by the religion.
I like that what you guys are touching on there, and I kinda think the same way. I believe in intelligent design for sure, to me it just makes pure logical sense as much as I can make of it, but at the same time as I see how logic beats faith, I overrule it with the fact that people make their own truth. If an uneducated child bought up in the deepest jungle was told the sky was blue because it was painted, how could he ever know different. We make human truths and logic within our parameters, but theres stuff out there we don't know and can't explain, supernatural stuff. Stuff so complex im sure it cannot be random.
You raise an excellent point. We, as humans, make up our own facts. Everything we know to be as fact was actually invented by another person at one time or another. In actuality, nobody really knows anything for sure. And that's why religion is good, because it provides an explanation for all of these questions and mysteries. Sure, we might have evolved since then and "discovered" new sciences and "explained" how things work, so there's not as much mystery to it. However, how do we know that science, as we know it, isn't completely wrong? We may have made an explanation for why the sky is blue, but we can't really know for sure.
Quote from: The_Enigma on October 09, 2009, 09:19:03 PM
However, how do we know that science, as we know it, isn't completely wrong?
Simple, you use it's creations and accomplishments to know what it's right about. Light bulbs and other electronics wouldn't work if our current level of science was wrong about electricity. Airplanes wouldn't fly if science was wrong about aerodynamics. Cars can't exist without engineering, biology is needed to make vaccines, and most consumer products require knowledge of chemistry.
Our technology wouldn't work if science was wrong. But who knows, when we someday learn dimensional physics science might end up proving there is a god, and then all this debate will have been for nothing. Wouldn't that be ironic?
Quote from: Serika on October 09, 2009, 09:52:48 PM
Light bulbs and other electronics wouldn't work if our current level of science was wrong about electricity. Airplanes wouldn't fly if science was wrong about aerodynamics. Cars can't exist without engineering, biology is needed to make vaccines, and most consumer products require knowledge of chemistry.
Our technology wouldn't work if science was wrong.
Well you know, we could be like the Orcs from Warhammer 40k.
RED THINGS GO FASTER!
God? I'm not a believer, i'm a science girl what i believe in is in energy+chemistry what in my opinion is what really let the world go on.
Nothing about something that create us and that stuff. I want believe in god until soemone demostrate that it exists.
Also I have a friend that is super religious, is really a pain in the ass to talk about religion , god... with him!! his a bit closed minded i have no problem to respect others opinion but seriously he's too close about this.
Like last night a friend stated that roman gods could exist, no one demostrate that they doesn't exist yet, and the other guy stated that she was wrong that there was an only god...he's really impossible in this stuff ^^U
I'm not trying to be mean or put anyone down but, am I the only one who finds it humorous that we are having a religious discussion on a fetish based website :lol:
If I had to call myself anything, I would say that I'm agnostic. I can't say that I really feel strongly about anything.
And really, I mean, who gives a shit. Lets just live our lives, be good people, and have some fun along the way.
Quote from: Loki275 on October 12, 2009, 01:46:30 AM
I'm not trying to be mean or put anyone down but, am I the only one who finds it humorous that we are having a religious discussion on a fetish based website :lol:
If I had to call myself anything, I would say that I'm agnostic. I can't say that I really feel strongly about anything.
And really, I mean, who gives a shit. Lets just live our lives, be good people, and have some fun along the way.
I like your thinking, sir! I am of the same attitude, only I happen to believe in God. When it boils right down to it, it's not like God himself directly affects anything that we know about, so we might as well just live our lives out anyway. Is it really that hard to be a good person without something telling you to do so?
Quote from: Serika on October 09, 2009, 09:52:48 PM
Quote from: The_Enigma on October 09, 2009, 09:19:03 PM
However, how do we know that science, as we know it, isn't completely wrong?
Simple, you use it's creations and accomplishments to know what it's right about. Light bulbs and other electronics wouldn't work if our current level of science was wrong about electricity. Airplanes wouldn't fly if science was wrong about aerodynamics. Cars can't exist without engineering, biology is needed to make vaccines, and most consumer products require knowledge of chemistry.
Our technology wouldn't work if science was wrong. But who knows, when we someday learn dimensional physics science might end up proving there is a god, and then all this debate will have been for nothing. Wouldn't that be ironic?
Prove it. I demand a third party - someone who has not grown up learning earth science - to perform experiments, or at least confirm/deny our accuracy.
Quote from: The_Enigma on October 14, 2009, 02:15:03 PM
Prove it. I demand a third party - someone who has not grown up learning earth science - to perform experiments, or at least confirm/deny our accuracy.
If the computer you're using to read this isn't proof enough that man's science is accurate and legitimate then i don't believe there's anything else i can say. :S
I wasn't even saying religion is wrong, i was just trying to defend the work that scientists have done over the centuries...
Quote from: The_Enigma on October 14, 2009, 02:13:41 PM
Quote from: Loki275 on October 12, 2009, 01:46:30 AM
I'm not trying to be mean or put anyone down but, am I the only one who finds it humorous that we are having a religious discussion on a fetish based website :lol:
If I had to call myself anything, I would say that I'm agnostic. I can't say that I really feel strongly about anything.
And really, I mean, who gives a shit. Lets just live our lives, be good people, and have some fun along the way.
I like your thinking, sir! I am of the same attitude, only I happen to believe in God. When it boils right down to it, it's not like God himself directly affects anything that we know about, so we might as well just live our lives out anyway. Is it really that hard to be a good person without something telling you to do so?
I like your thinking to! Indifference Hi-Five!
Alright!l Tolerance 1, Intolerance....4,280,389.....
...well at least we got one ;D
Quote from: Loki275 on October 15, 2009, 12:48:16 AM
Quote from: The_Enigma on October 14, 2009, 02:13:41 PM
Quote from: Loki275 on October 12, 2009, 01:46:30 AM
I'm not trying to be mean or put anyone down but, am I the only one who finds it humorous that we are having a religious discussion on a fetish based website :lol:
If I had to call myself anything, I would say that I'm agnostic. I can't say that I really feel strongly about anything.
And really, I mean, who gives a shit. Lets just live our lives, be good people, and have some fun along the way.
I like your thinking, sir! I am of the same attitude, only I happen to believe in God. When it boils right down to it, it's not like God himself directly affects anything that we know about, so we might as well just live our lives out anyway. Is it really that hard to be a good person without something telling you to do so?
I like your thinking to! Indifference Hi-Five!
Alright!l Tolerance 1, Intolerance....4,280,389.....
...well at least we got one ;D
ALRIGHT! Really, people need to learn to respect other people's opinions. And also to not force their opinions onto someone else.
Quote from: Serika on October 14, 2009, 05:42:25 PM
Quote from: The_Enigma on October 14, 2009, 02:15:03 PM
Prove it. I demand a third party - someone who has not grown up learning earth science - to perform experiments, or at least confirm/deny our accuracy.
If the computer you're using to read this isn't proof enough that man's science is accurate and legitimate then i don't believe there's anything else i can say. :S
I wasn't even saying religion is wrong, i was just trying to defend the work that scientists have done over the centuries...
The point I'm trying to make is that everyone on earth has grown up learning what people on earth have discovered. There's nothing to compare our science to, so we just assume we're correct. In actuality, we might be completely wrong about everything we know, but managed to manipulate the correct way into a way that we can use, either by coincidence or accident. (i.e. harnessing electricity)
I mean 500 or so years ago, it was SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN that the world was flat, the earth was the center of the universe, and that life spawned out of things called "ethers."
I'm just trying to play devil's advocate here, so we get both sides of the spectrum. That's how good discussion is made.
I highly doubt that us using electricity is a coincidence or an accident. Were it just that, we would have insanely high rates of power failures (even more than we do) and we wouldn't be able to fix any of it.
No... I don't think it's just a coincidence that not only have we harnessed electricity but also safely manipulated not just the technics of rocket propulsion but gravity itself to deliver men safely to the moon and back.
And I don't think it was ever scientifically proven that life either spawned from ethers or gases; that's just an old wives' tail or pure superstition invented to explain something that couldn't be proven scientifically. It held no more scientific weight than saying Zeus hurled lightning bolts and that's where they came from, which is a more religious explanation than scientific. =P
I believe that people human-invented representations of God are misled, but I also feel that spirituality is an essential part of life- especially to any creature intelligent enough to question it's own existence. A purpose and reason for life are extremely paramount to our well-being and happiness.
I personally have been reflected in all lights of the spiritual and emotional spectrum- depressed, indifferent, exuberant; atheist, agnostic, and devout, and the hues between. I have seen God, and I have doubted it, and I have realized that God is within us, it is a part of us. It is an answer to questions we shouldn't have to answer, but given the unforgivable perversion of nature; the technology and evolution of humans, we have been given this burden and blessing to be able to experience a level of sentience unparalleled by our brother and sister animals. Do they tilt their heads up and wonder what the stars are for? Wolves, perhaps, are howling towards the heavens, asking their God for forgiveness, praying devoutly and wailing away their sins. Is this what humans do? God in a Christian light has been present for many reasons, and these days, a strong sense of family, community, purpose and (some form of) knowledge seem to be important parts of this. There is nothing wrong with that.
I do not think that we are the chosen ones or that we are special, but in the same way that everything is different and nothing the same, we ARE special and God-given; God being the Universe, Space and Time- a Pendulum repeating it's course, each swing so precious and beautiful it tears itself apart. The afterlife is what the beforelife was- we are simply particles that assembled to create a living being. They will disassemble again and relent. It is an enormous burden to keep up living, this is why it must end, and why death should not be frightening, nor relieving, exactly, but ALRIGHT.
Of course spirituality and God in it's many forms are important. If something gives the intrinsic questions a slackening of pressure, or even a pseudo-answer to last our bodies/brains through our lives (because all we are is star matter- dust, nothingness, dark black holes), then GOOD. All we have is a blink of an eye. Why spend it in anger at others' innocent ignorance? If something gives relief, LET IT. This is why atheism doesn't work for me: Spirituality, or God, hopefulness, or enlightenment- whatever you call it- it is a leavening of pressure on our dangerous intelligence, and we NEED it to stay sane- it is indeed built into us.
Honestly, most human religions seem silly to me, but the deep calm that washes over me when I look up to the sky is undeniable. Everything is conceived by the same mother- whoever, whatever that might be, and it is all connected and all intensely beautiful. I wish that these stars called homo sapiens could see that.
Wall of TEXT = BAD.
Could you please separate some of that? :death:
I lean towards Buddhism. The 4 noble truths and the 8 fold path seems like a very healthy way of living your life. The concepts of karma and rebirth makes sense to me. I cant really say I'm a good buddhist though.
I really like the way that Buddhism is very compatable with science as well..